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Thread: Drug testing at a Pain Clinic

  1. Default Drug testing at a Pain Clinic

    Question I have is I take two different drugs on a regular basis, however smoke also on a regular basis..

    don't want pain clinic to know I smoke..

    Will the meds I take now which are Propranolol and Keppra show up in the test? Because I am thinking on using someone elses... And don't want them to say well your other drugs didn't show up...

    That happened before, however it was methadone not a beta blocker or a seizure med...

    I just don't want to use someone elses and they say well your other drugs didnt' show up...


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    @liveyourlife

    In order to answer your question, could you be a little more specific? "smoke on a regular basis". This is irrelevant, unless you mean smoking marijuana, in which case it is highly relevant.

    Use someone else's what? Urine? You're going to use someone else's urine? What is your goal here? You want your urine to show what it is supposed to show, i.e.-it should reflect what you're prescribed. So it goes without saying that you're not taking what's prescribed. Are you selling it? That's the only reason you wouldn't use it but continue to ask for a prescription. Have you found someone whose urine does show methadone and you want to use that, and are afraid that the lack of keppra and propranalol will give you away because you're prescribed the latter two drugs?

    Your motives are obvious. To deceive the pain clinic, and your only possible motive could be in order to illegally sell your prescription medicine. Sorry, I refuse to help you do that.

    However, in the spirit of collegiality, I will say this much: gas chromatography/mass spectrometry will show every drug metabolite that's in the urine of every possible prescription or illicit drug. It will be obvious to them that it's not your urine. I advise you to stop selling your prescription medication.

    If you have a valid reason for not using your medicine, then discontinue your prescription. However, if you can come up with a good excuse why you're attempting deceit, I'm all ears!
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    Quote Originally Posted by liveyourlife View Post
    Question I have is I take two different drugs on a regular basis, however smoke also on a regular basis..
    THC is usually tested for now in reputable pain clinics. It isn't a regulation, but most want to know if the patient is abusing illegal substances, and marijuana is no different.

    So you will need to be clean of THC for this test.

    Will the meds I take now which are Propranolol and Keppra show up in the test? Because I am thinking on using someone elses... And don't want them to say well your other drugs didn't show up...
    No.. the beta blocker, propanolol.. and Keppra will not show up in a drug Tox screen. You do not have to worry here.

    That happened before, however it was methadone not a beta blocker or a seizure med...
    Well, methadone is always going to test positive.. opiates/morphine are always tested. So this isn't a surprise. Whoever you got the 'urine' from either isn't a good friend (if a friend at all),.. or is incredibly dumb.

    I just don't want to use someone elses and they say well your other drugs didnt' show up...
    You don't have to worry about that. The THC, in YOUR system yes.

    If you stopped smoking long enough for THC not to test positive you wouldn't have a problem here. But, regardless Keppra and Propanalol are not tested for. They don't waste your or their money on legitimate , non recreational medications.

  4. Clinics will not accept you if you have any other drugs in your system other than the ones you're going there for. Propanolol is a beta blocker and won't show up on a drug test. And if you need to fail it for certain drugs, you could always get synthetic urine or clean urine and purposefully put a small amount of powerized drugs into the urine which would still cause you to fail for them, if that's what you need.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Neofate View Post
    Well, methadone is always going to test positive. So this isn't a surprise.
    From what I've seen, methadone, being a fully synthetic opioid, must be specifically tested for in any multi-panel UA so I don't believe it will always test positive.
    For instance, it is currently not included (along with fentanyl) in the DOT testing protocol for school bus and long haul truck driver licensing. An error that really should be addressed I believe.
    I have seen instances where an opiate like morphine might appear positive on an initial test, have specimen sent to a lab and result in methadone detection.
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    Quote Originally Posted by alumni View Post
    From what I've seen, methadone, being a fully synthetic opioid, must be specifically tested for in any multi-panel UA so I don't believe it will always test positive.
    For instance, it is currently not included (along with fentanyl) in the DOT testing protocol for school bus and long haul truck driver licensing. An error that really should be addressed I believe.
    I have seen instances where an opiate like morphine might appear positive on an initial test, have specimen sent to a lab and result in methadone detection.
    You are correct -- Methadone is a highly synthetic opioid -- technically not an 'Opiate' -- but I hate those that cut hairs like that. Opiate and Opioid are universally transferable.

    Anyhow what I meant was for this case -- with her specific testing -- Methadone would be tested for.

    Which is quite obvious with her previous test being positive for , ... methadone.

    What differs in these assays are the metabolites. In Methadones example the EDDP is analyzed. What is EDDP -- well it doesn't help much unless you are a chemistry major:

    2-ethylidene-1,5-dimethyl-3,3-diphenylpyrrolidine

    But, Methadone isn't a typical Opiate /poppy synthetic derivative.. it is in the diphenylpropylamine family. Which is not from the Poppy plant,.. so technically isn't an "Opiate" -- though it gets its classification from its full on U-opioid receptor agonism. It has secondary characteristics from the NMDA action.

    But good call on the difference and correction of methadone being tested for on a routine assay.. say for a job interview/position, etc.

    Which means +1 rep for you

    Thanks,

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    Although the OP's two meds are not abusable, that doesn't mean they won't test for it. My PM tests for all my medicines, how much is in my system, etc. They want to know that you are taking all prescribed meds and not just the narcotic or CNS type drugs.

    I'd give up the MJ and have a few drinks or something. It stays in your system so long that eventually you will get busted.

    Just a thought that doesn't have to do with MJ. While researching some medicines last year I found out that Soma stays in your system for at least 3 weeks. I'm glad I don't take it now and glad my first PM clinic didn't test for it!

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    I heard of a pain clinic here in Arizona that does this. Surely they do not all do this testing right? Seems a little intrusive to me, what business is it of theirs if you smoke a little herb. What do the substances you ingest have to do with your need for pain relief. Perhaps its for liability on their part if you mix the wrong things, but still it should be up to the individual what we put in our own bodies.
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    Quote Originally Posted by RealGrapey View Post
    I heard of a pain clinic here in Arizona that does this. Surely they do not all do this testing right? Seems a little intrusive to me, what business is it of theirs if you smoke a little herb. What do the substances you ingest have to do with your need for pain relief. Perhaps its for liability on their part if you mix the wrong things, but still it should be up to the individual what we put in our own bodies.
    Unfortunately pain clinics are very interested in anything that you put in your system. MJ has gotten many patients thrown out so it's the last thing I'd use.

    It might seem intrusive, but many people who go to pain clinics have to sign a contract that says the doctor will treat your pain with narcotics and whatever else you need, and you will not take anything else but what he prescribes. You also have to agree to constant UAs, pill counts and whatever else they want. My old pain clinic was so strict that they tested for every substance they could think of, checked off every box on that form and had them test to 0% (which means if any amount of meds was in your system that shouldn't be you were in trouble). Most places like employment, etc. would test to a certain percentage so something could be in your system but wouldn't be detected because they didn't test to that low a count.

    They are covering their butts so they don't lose their licenses.
    And people lie. All the time, especially when it comes to narcotics. You have to figure that a certain percentage at every clinic is simply getting the meds to sell. That's why the urine tests will tell them exactly how much is in their system. The only people I've known that didn't ever get tested were people suing someone after a car accident. Their attorney sends them to a 'doctor' who prescribes tons of meds to prove this person is hurt. They just sell their meds because they aren't hurt and we all pay for it. Gotta love it.
    Helpful SpaceMatters Rated helpful
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  10. Default pain clinic testing

    Yeah make no mistake they will test you, and you wont know ehen as they are pretty sneaky about wanting you to wizz in the bottlem after you,get to your appointment and YES they jerks will dismiss you as a patient there. Pain Clinics are the Dr's answer to DEA fear.

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    @Neofate, you are 100% correct. Test positive for MJ and PM will kick your ass to the curb. A very good friend of mine's mother has severe pain issues on top of multi-personaility disorder as a result PTSD from being sexually abused by her father. She tested positive and was booted from PM. There is no leeway for even the most sympathetic patients.

    @Lynx4, not to be preachy but it never a smart idea to drink and take PK. I'm sure we all know the dangers of mixing narcotics with alcohol, but depending on the PK, tylenol and alcohol is a lethal combo. Mixing just once can be fatal or cause permanent liver damage, no matter what dosage. It all depends how your body is processing that day. Even if you are not taking it at the same time, I assume if you are in PM you are taking meds quite regularly. If your PK contains tylenol, your liver will be in overdrive trying to detoxify and shouldn't be put to the test. I hate myself for drinking on the very rare occasions I do (special occasions - weddings etc.)

    @sixty9blunts I wouldn't be encouraging someone to falsify a drug test. That is fraud.

    @RealGrapey, @mrcreepers, they are being intrusive or jerks. They are prescribing you DRUGS. When it comes down to it PK are highly addictive, potentially dangerous controlled substances. @Lynx4, they are doing more than just covering their butts (although yes, that's a major reason they do it), if you really think about it they are covering yours! Who care how much it benefits them, it benefits you more in the long run. You in PM to live a better life and destroying your health doesn't serve that end.

    Ok, I'm done with tirade. Sorry to get preachy and to bring up an older post. But it's people like @liveyourlife who "ruin" it for those actually need pain medication, giving us not only a bad rap, but making it much harder for us to receive the care and prescriptions we really need.

    I'm also tired, grumpy from studying, in a lot of pain, and trying to get my meds changed but there is hesitance to switch to something stronger because of people like this.
    "Life is your right, so don't give up the fight!" - Bob Marley

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    @Jolie, I wasn't saying that I drank, but was just saying that if the OP of the thread needed to do something, perhaps having a drink instead of smoking MJ might be better as far as urine tests go. Since MJ stays in the system so long it's only a matter of time before s/he gets a dirty UA, and at least if he just has a beer occasionally it shouldn't show up on a UA or interact as much as MJ. You know?

    I never drink with my meds because I'm on Methadone. That's a really bad combination so I drink water and let everyone else get drunk

    I just took a UA yesterday actually. I was happy to because my doctor is great and I'm on the right combination of medicines right now to help me live better. I love him and I actually told him yesterday that when I say Thank You every month before I leave that it's not a throw away phrase; I actually and truly mean Thank You and I wish I could give my doctor to many people on this site. It's so hard to find a great doctor so I'll be holding tight to him!
    Last edited by Lynx4; 06-16-2011 at 08:18 AM. Reason: ha! I wrote UV instead of UA; time to get some sun
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    @Lynx4, sorry, I wasn't implying you did. Just some people aren't smart enough to know that real dangers. You obviously are. Sadly, it's much safer to smoke MJ.

    I understand really meaning the thank you. I hope I can mean it today!

    Update: I really did mean it and couldn't stop saying it!
    Last edited by Jolie; 06-21-2011 at 06:28 PM. Reason: Update
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  14. #14
    yep i had a friend that would get random calls from her doctor asking her to come in the next day and bring her bottle with her. she would get her pills counted and then have to take a drug test.

  15. Hello liveyourlife, Are you going to a methadone clinic or pain clinic? ( They both will look for illegal drugs or self medication -non medicating - etc...) I imagine you are talking about M.J. when you say you smoke? (But, I could be wrong?) I was told by a pain Dr. in the past the U.A. are for their protection - especially with LE breathing down their necks over prescribing controlled meds. ( Also in the cases when patients accidentally die from extra self medicating - overdoses - Etc...) I hope everything will work out for you, GOOD LUCK, CHEESE

  16. This is an idea that someone told me about and they say it works for them. They will pee in a cup when they are clean of drugs they are not supposed to have in them, then they will refrigerate or maybe freeze the urine for later use . They would then bring the urine with them in some type of container when they saw thier pain doc. If they got tested they would just use the urine that they knew was clean since they were not monitored for the pee test.
    My doc tests me every 3-4 months , which if you ask me is a bit excessive being that I have not ever failed a test in over 3 years since seeing them. The tests costs me $100 each time they give it to me, and now thewy expect me to pay for it on the spot too.
    so I always have to carry an extra $100 with me when I go to the clnic.
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  17. #17
    I used to see a Pain Managment Dr. Every couple of months she would do random urine tests. She was checking to make sure your meds were in your system and that nothing else was. She was pretty laid back when it came to pot. It was the hard stuff that was an issue. She would terminate you if did not come back clean. There was one time I was a bit worried. I went to a head shop and got a drink. I do not remember the name. But basically you drink it than pee a few times. Then you take your test. Its my understanding that it blocks things from showing up in your urine for a few hours. I have used the drink a few times and it works. The only issue is if they are checking to make sure your meds are in your system because they won't show up!

  18. Your going to have to give a small dose of the meds you are prescribed to the person your getting urine from so the meds show up on the test.. Pain in the ass but if you want to smoke and be in pain management it's the only way.

  19. Quote Originally Posted by crwhitlock View Post
    Your going to have to give a small dose of the meds you are prescribed to the person your getting urine from so the meds show up on the test.. Pain in the ass but if you want to smoke and be in pain management it's the only way.
    Hey, I'm new to the forums. My regular dr has been giving me pain meds for the last 6 months or so(for scoliosis), and now wants me to go to a pain clinic which i have been avoiding until now because i smoke. I have someone who is willing to give me his urine, but I've been skeptical to do so. does it really only take a small dose?

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    @x23perfectsinsx,
    Unfortunately they would need to take the same dosage as you, a small amount wont do it, your urine will also be tested for the amount of medication (therapeutic level) so just giving someone one "a little bit" isn't going to do it, nor adding the raw medication to the urine ,you are running the risk of losing your treatment and being branded depending how you approach this, Honesty might be your best option depending on your Dr, Most of these urine test situations can easily turn into a cluster ****
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