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Thread: Non-opiate Strong Pain killer??

  1. Default Non-opiate Strong Pain killer??

    I have no problem with opiates, and use them when necessary to deal with chronic pain, but my wife, who suffers from ongoing acute bouts of intense pain (several times a month) rather than persistent daily pain, gets nauseous and ill when she takes anything that is opiate-based or derivative (hydrocodone, oxycodone, buprenorphine, etc.). She needs something strong when these attacks come, just to function, but since she is highly sensitive to opiates she doesn't know where to turn. Neither do I.

    I am looking for some type of prescription pain killer that is not opiate in any form. Does anyone know of anything??


  2. 800mg Ibuprofen tabs. You need a script for them. But, Ibuprofen is the strongest easy to get pain reliever, and 800mg ibuprofen has been proven more effective than treating pain than 30mg of codeine. Also, Ibuprofen was a scheduled drug at one point in time. It is far stronger than asprin or tylenol

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    Quote Originally Posted by Slovey View Post
    I have no problem with opiates, and use them when necessary to deal with chronic pain, but my wife, who suffers from ongoing acute bouts of intense pain (several times a month) rather than persistent daily pain, gets nauseous and ill when she takes anything that is opiate-based or derivative (hydrocodone, oxycodone, buprenorphine, etc.). She needs something strong when these attacks come, just to function, but since she is highly sensitive to opiates she doesn't know where to turn. Neither do I.

    I am looking for some type of prescription pain killer that is not opiate in any form. Does anyone know of anything??
    What type of pain is it, more specifically? (Muscle, joint, nerve, etc.) Honestly, I don't know if you're going to find much eliminating all opiates and their derivatives. I've found that Naproxem (Aleve) is probably one of the stronger OTC pain medications, but it's OTC, so that should tell you what to expect. And whats the point of getting a script of 800mg ibuprofen? May as well just pop 4 OTC pills and avoid the hassle.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nigw View Post
    800mg Ibuprofen tabs. You need a script for them. But, Ibuprofen is the strongest easy to get pain reliever, and 800mg ibuprofen has been proven more effective than treating pain than 30mg of codeine. Also, Ibuprofen was a scheduled drug at one point in time. It is far stronger than asprin or tylenol
    You could just take 4 200mg over the counter ibuprofen tablets and get the same effect. Ibuprofen is better then codeine for pain that is caused by inflammation, but I doubt its as good for neurological pain.

    You need to be more specific as to the type of pain your wife is experiencing.

  5. well. He asked for a prescription pain killer. And sine the 200mg OTCs are not prescription, I thought 800mg tabs fell into his criteria better.

  6. Yes, as others have mentioned, we need to know what type of pain your wife is experiencing. Bone pain, muscle pain, nerve pain? What is the pain and what causes the pain? Each painkiller has its best purpose, and also, each painkiller has its own side effects (for instance, 800mg ibuprofen might be great for muscle pain or inflammation, but could cause really bad stomach problems.)
    In other words, more info needed.

  7. Maybe she can try tramadol?

  8. #8
    For me, 800 mg of ibuprofen usually does the trick. If I have a really really bad toothache or the starting of a migraine or horrible "cramps" or a sprained ankle or arthritis pain/carpel tunnel type pain...this will work better than tylenol or any type of opiate based med. For some reason, the motrin 800 rx works better. It might be all in my head as I know it is the same amount of medication in 4 over the counter IBs, but maybe it has something to do with it all being concentrated into one pill? Who knows...other people have told me the same thing too, so maybe we are all nuts. Also, another med in the same type of category is toradol. This med is GREAT for after sugery pain but you can't take it long term. I hope that helps a little? I think those would be way stronger than tramadol. In my experience anyway.

  9. Quote Originally Posted by Nubzor View Post
    What type of pain is it, more specifically? (Muscle, joint, nerve, etc.) Honestly, I don't know if you're going to find much eliminating all opiates and their derivatives. I've found that Naproxem (Aleve) is probably one of the stronger OTC pain medications, but it's OTC, so that should tell you what to expect. And whats the point of getting a script of 800mg ibuprofen? May as well just pop 4 OTC pills and avoid the hassle.
    Quote Originally Posted by PanAtomicX View Post
    Yes, as others have mentioned, we need to know what type of pain your wife is experiencing. Bone pain, muscle pain, nerve pain? What is the pain and what causes the pain? Each painkiller has its best purpose, and also, each painkiller has its own side effects (for instance, 800mg ibuprofen might be great for muscle pain or inflammation, but could cause really bad stomach problems.)
    In other words, more info needed.
    Sorry for the delayed response. Her pain is related to her menstrual cycle, but the pain is hard to categorize. It would probably best be described as endometrial pain - nerve. She has intense, sharp pain on one side of her abdomen for about 5-10 days each month. She has had all types of tests and she had surgery, but they haven't found a way to help her.

    She has tried hydrocodone, oxycodone, darvocet, codeine, tramadol, buprenorphine and she has had a bad physical reaction to all except for tramadol, which wasn't strong enough to help. She currently alternates 1000mg of acetaminophen and 400mg of ibuprofen every two hours - 24 hours a day (when she has the attacks). She has tried 800mg of ibuprofen but the problem is more of a situation that the pain medicine doesn't last long enough. In other words, she can take 800mg of ibuprofen, and it will take 30 minutes or so to kick in and the relief will be for 1.5 hrs if she is lucky. She needs something stronger so that even when the drug is not at its peak of release it is still enough to manage the pain. And, since she is very sensitive to opiates, it is difficult to find something. That is why I am asking here.

  10. #10
    menstrual cycle mefenamic acid may help. i wrote a post about this i think last week. black cohosh, alka seltzer, hot tea, salads, caffeine, and or hot pack. vomiting may help as well. i find that starting this at the onset helps. moderate exercise and laying in the fetal position may give some relief. she may want to look into birth control pills. they did not work for me long term but i think they helped somewhat.
    now i use black cohosh, caffeine, mefenamic acid(sp), vicodin,vilumin, aromatherapy, and lying in a triangle. i am much better than i use to be. i would black out.
    its late and i am not spell checking
    Last edited by islode; 05-12-2011 at 03:53 AM.

  11. Muscle relaxers (carisprodol or even valium) and ibuprofen. Most menstrual cramps and pains are deep muscle cramps. She can take a lot of ibuprofen as long as it is only for a few days at a time, and make sure she takes it with food.

    Heat. Hot packs, hot water bottle, hot baths.

    Do not take tylenol, it will do nothing.

    Also, I realize the last thing she will want to do is exercise, but there are yoga positions that really work to alleviate the pain. Google yoga for menstruation.

    But mainly? Muscle relaxers, heat on the belly, and ibuprofen in huge amounts.
    Last edited by PanAtomicX; 05-12-2011 at 05:33 AM.

  12. I have a question for the op... what constitutes a "bad reaction" to *all the opioid painkillers you listed*? Say hypothetically you took a little too much, or have a lower tolerance than most people? I'm really sensitive to methadone and bupe. When I take methadone, 10mg is about like taking an OC 60 to me. At baseline tolerance, I will puke forever if I take 20mg. I'm wondering if maybe you are just very sensitive to opiates and just should take less? Maybe you are one of those people that just has had all you need at like 5mg of hydrocodone?

  13. Diazepam can work quite well as a painkiller in some situations. Dilofenac as a non-opioid painkiller than some IOPs carry also

  14. Try tramadol or any of the popular muscle relaxers. Tramadol can be a silver bullet for a lot of people but it can interact with other meds like SSRIs. Be careful and do your research!

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    You may already know this and I may have interpreted the information incorrectly , but had to mention after reading the post just to be sure :
    Make sure that she keeps an eye on the dose of tylenol. From your post you said that she alternates between 1g tylenol (acetaminophen) and 400 mg Ibuprofen every 2 hours around the clock . This would mean that she is taking 1g of tylenol every four hours which would amount to 6g in a 24 hour period which definitely exceeds what is considered a safe daily dose. Tylenol toxicity can be serious and although exceeding the dosage for a day may not be an issue, if she is doing it for several days it could be.

    I hope that she is able to find a solution and feels better soon . Pain is a tough thing to live with as many here, myself included, are aware .

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    As others have said I can think of nothing but strong Ibuprofen tabs, which sucks because they mess with my stomach and don't even help that much. I truly think narcotics are the only ones that really help for strong pain, they just need to find a way so that tolerance does not rise so rapidly and weaning down is easier than pain sufferers would be golden.

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    Post TBird

    Tramadol & some NSAIDS meds can go together research it out-- As always be careful-Hope you find something that will help---
    Last edited by Bnjar5; 05-12-2011 at 11:41 PM. Reason: added info

  18. #18
    I know this could sound like a long shot, but kratom really does seem to work well on pain in the right mixture. It works on opiate receivers in the brain,yet its not an opiate. I would recommend the stem and vein poweder to mix in specifically, as it seems to have the best pain dulling properties per gram. I could probably ramble on but Il give you more info if this seems like a viable option you might want to try.

  19. Ever considered giving her an antihistamine with her opiates? (promethazine expecially or cetrezine advised) This may aleviate most of the side effects

  20. First - Thanks to everyone who replied. I appreciate the time and effort.

    Second - I should have been more specific. My wife's problem is mainly during ovulation. She has had pain during her period, but it is mainly during ovulation. Also, the pain is so intense that she cannot move. It can come in waves and it is usually more intense at night.

    Quote Originally Posted by islode View Post
    menstrual cycle mefenamic acid may help. i wrote a post about this i think last week. black cohosh, alka seltzer, hot tea, salads, caffeine, and or hot pack. vomiting may help as well. i find that starting this at the onset helps. moderate exercise and laying in the fetal position may give some relief. she may want to look into birth control pills. they did not work for me long term but i think they helped somewhat.
    now i use black cohosh, caffeine, mefenamic acid(sp), vicodin,vilumin, aromatherapy, and lying in a triangle. i am much better than i use to be. i would black out.
    its late and i am not spell checking
    Blacking out is intense!!! I am glad you are better and don't have to deal with that anymore. I will have to look into some of the things you suggest. Concerning birth control, she is not willing to do that at this point because she (we) believes that there are potentially very dangerous long-term effects from hormonal use (of any type) and because she had a really bad reaction when she took it years ago.

    Quote Originally Posted by PanAtomicX View Post
    Muscle relaxers (carisprodol or even valium) and ibuprofen. Most menstrual cramps and pains are deep muscle cramps. She can take a lot of ibuprofen as long as it is only for a few days at a time, and make sure she takes it with food.

    Heat. Hot packs, hot water bottle, hot baths.

    Do not take tylenol, it will do nothing.

    Also, I realize the last thing she will want to do is exercise, but there are yoga positions that really work to alleviate the pain. Google yoga for menstruation.

    But mainly? Muscle relaxers, heat on the belly, and ibuprofen in huge amounts.
    I am not really sure that it is menstrual cramps - that was as close as I could describe. It may be, but we don't know. She can't really do yoga since she can't move - which is kind of like really slow yoga

    Quote Originally Posted by CreamPuffWar View Post
    I have a question for the op... what constitutes a "bad reaction" to *all the opioid painkillers you listed*? Say hypothetically you took a little too much, or have a lower tolerance than most people? I'm really sensitive to methadone and bupe. When I take methadone, 10mg is about like taking an OC 60 to me. At baseline tolerance, I will puke forever if I take 20mg. I'm wondering if maybe you are just very sensitive to opiates and just should take less? Maybe you are one of those people that just has had all you need at like 5mg of hydrocodone?
    For example: Taking two halves of a 5mg Percocet - one at midnight and the second at 3am - has caused her to react with extreme dizziness and throwing up until she was dry-heaving. She has tried anti-nausea/motion-sickness medication, but it only postponed the reaction...it didn't stop it.

    Quote Originally Posted by sbg View Post
    You may already know this and I may have interpreted the information incorrectly , but had to mention after reading the post just to be sure :
    Make sure that she keeps an eye on the dose of tylenol. From your post you said that she alternates between 1g tylenol (acetaminophen) and 400 mg Ibuprofen every 2 hours around the clock . This would mean that she is taking 1g of tylenol every four hours which would amount to 6g in a 24 hour period which definitely exceeds what is considered a safe daily dose. Tylenol toxicity can be serious and although exceeding the dosage for a day may not be an issue, if she is doing it for several days it could be.

    I hope that she is able to find a solution and feels better soon . Pain is a tough thing to live with as many here, myself included, are aware .
    Yes, I am aware that she is exceeding the recommended daily dosage (which they have even considered lowering), and that it is very dangerous, and she knows it too. But, the pain is so intense, and she has no other way to deal with it, so she feels trapped.

    Quote Originally Posted by itis View Post
    I know this could sound like a long shot, but kratom really does seem to work well on pain in the right mixture. It works on opiate receivers in the brain,yet its not an opiate. I would recommend the stem and vein poweder to mix in specifically, as it seems to have the best pain dulling properties per gram. I could probably ramble on but Il give you more info if this seems like a viable option you might want to try.
    I had never heard of kratom before you mentioned it. I am sure she would try it, but I will confess I am skeptical. I have nothing against homeopathic treatments, and I have tried many myself for my own issues, but I have only experienced/witnessed mildly helpful "remedies".

    Quote Originally Posted by ColourfulKronos View Post
    Ever considered giving her an antihistamine with her opiates? (promethazine expecially or cetrezine advised) This may aleviate most of the side effects
    Beside the anti-nausea and anti-motion sickness, she has tried antihistamines - without any luck


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