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Thread: Hydrocodone by itself, with no apap?

  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by akl63 View Post
    For the record I never even said the word codeine in my post and never even talked about it. I'm estimating losing 2 percent as I always put my norcos in water and drink them so I'm not feeling anything different. I was taking the pills everyday, so I felt better to do an extraction. I've seen plenty of people with liver problems and no solution, so I do whatever I can to save mine. Ingesting 4g of acetaminophen daily for over six months isn't something I'm comfortable with.
    Bottom line the guy asked how to do an extraction and I answered him with the best way. And the way you know that the leftover powder is all APAP is that hydrocodone is soluble it water, APAP is barely.
    Dude, why are you responding to me for in first place above. I was referencing OP in original my post to this thread and never you so not sure why you needed to point that out to me. I just assumed you were OP when you started down this codeine line thing since its was directed to OP in the first place and OP does keep talking about codeine. I understand now . . .

    Anyways, do you know the actual particle size of hydro and APAP (guess you will look up know). I never read your original post in this thread as I thought OP, but I see now that you use coffee filter. Dude, that probably lets lots of APAP though but if you are happy with results that's all that matters. Haha, coffee filter if far from scientific and just because water soluble does not mean there is still some remaining in sludgy form mixed up with sludgy APAP. Again, I agree you are reducing APAP, but your also reducing hydro and not even necessary if you are just using norcos as prescribed or in a reasonable manner.

    Do you realize how little volume a 10 mg peice of hydrocodone would occupy. Very tiny. Even Roxi 30s have a decent amount of fillers. Now look at the volume of APAP you have left over. You would almost have enough to make up a whole vicodin left over if you truly got all of the APAP, binders and fillers out. I have used much better filtration than you and ran it through multiple times in decreasing micron filters and I still did not have much gooey residue left over and not near enough to account for the large volume of APAP and fillers. Your still have particulate matter for everything the way you are doing it and even the good particulate matter will stick to the filter, get stuck or mixed in the goo and etc. 2 percent estimated loss of hydro and thinking you get most of the APAP out is probably not very accurate. Nonetheless, if you have fun doing it and it makes you happy, go for it.


  2. I am also looking for migraine fighting meds as the ones my doctor has prescribed have been ineffective.

    Also I'm trying to get my 3 posts in so I can particiate in the forum and discussions.

  3. #43
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    i am new to all of this. i have become a chronic pain patient with severe carpel tunnel going into my elbow and have lost alot of feeling in that hand also. not to mention slipped disks and go knows what else!
    would someone explain the difference between hyrocodone, oxycodone and oxycotin to me? i would like to save my liver from being abused! i currently take 10/325 4x a day, but the tylenol in it is killing my stomach. do i have any alernatives< txs so much

  4. Default Eat

    Most problems with moderate amounts of NSAID's have to do with taking them on an empty stomach. Unless you can get an opiate with no Tylenol, or even Ibuprofen in them, you should take the pain meds for desert, after a meal.

  5. #45
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    My MD prescribed me Hydro with IB its new version of vicoprofen called Reprexain for my migraines seems to take the edge of the decently, better than LB anyway.
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    Yes you can find hydro by itself but it is very hard to come by and even legit brick and motor pharmacies barely carry it because doctors rarely prescribe it. I have heard it is very potent and you can easily overdose. They come in low dose because they are so potent.

  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Torr View Post
    Yes you can find hydro by itself but it is very hard to come by and even legit brick and motor pharmacies barely carry it because doctors rarely prescribe it. I have heard it is very potent and you can easily overdose. They come in low dose because they are so potent.
    See, I just don't understand this at all. You can get oxy IRs any day of the week at any pharmacy (no APAP) and yet doctors won't prescribe a hydrocodone version? Since hydrocodone is not as strong as oxycodone you'd think they'd prescribe a hydro IR over an OxyIR any day.

    Hopefully they'll go that way soon. It may be that hydrocodone simply doesn't work as well without the APAP in it. I know for me that the 10/500's worked much better than the 10/325s and now that I'm on 15mg oxyIRs I often take either Tylenol or 1 Advil with it. The Advil is helpful for the inflammation I have in my shoulders and leg/back so mixing it with my Oxy IRs is perfect as long as I keep the Advil dose low. That stuff eats my stomach up so I can only take 2 Advil in any 24 hour period. Once I take two I move on to Tylenol with my Oxys.

  8. #48
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    You are correct the APAP is there to enhance the effectiveness of the Hydro. But it is out there without it. They are weird about prescribing it because it is the number one prescribed pain killer in the US and therefore making it the most abused. Doctors are real skittish lately.

  9. #49
    Last year I participated in a drug study.
    It was for a controlled release hydrocodone. Hydrocontin basically. Got 2 everyday. They were supposed to last 12 hrs, I think they only lasted 8-9. Kinda like oxycontin.

    It ended after a month.
    I took a survey and said I would consider replacing my current meds with this version of hydrocodone. I thought it worked well. They were 100mg I think. Looked kinda like an MS contin, the long ones.

    I probably didn't need to be taking that much Hydro in a day, but I did need to be getting free pain meds and doctor checkups.

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    We also have to remember there is less liver issues this way because no tylenol is involved and tylenol can be very hard on the liver especially in high doses. The liver can only take so much daily and some people often reach this limit and still have pain but do not want to take any more due to the tylenol.

  11. #51
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    there is a very simple, easy way to separate the hydrocodone from the APAP in pills such as Vicodin, Lortab, etc but i won't describe it here. it's very easy to find on the internet for anyone who is interested though.

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    ak163, That is a very interesting formula. I'm sure if it eventually comes on the market it will be a Schedule 11 and very hard to get prescribed, mostly pain mgt. And then there will be all of the same issues as with the oxy80s...food for future thought.

  13. #53
    When I signed up I thought it would be for Nucynta (Tapentadol) which they had been giving to a lot of CPPs instead of Oxycontin. Less negative stigma I think.

    I was very surpised to find out it was a controlled release Hydro. Which I always wondered to myself why they didn't have. I really haven't heard anything about it since.

    These drug studies can be quite helpful. I looked for another one that I could apply for, but couldn't find another one. It was really nice getting free meds and checkups every week.

    I originally thought I would be paid as well, apparently not for this one though. I know some people in the other studies were getting $75 a week. Probably they were taking more experimental drugs with inherent risks. I guess with the Hydrocodone, enough is known about it to be known as safe. Therefore not warranting any payment. Too bad.

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    @akl63 What kind of study was it? Open label? It sounds like you must have known what you were taking, unless there's a chance you got placebo.

    I'm guessing there's not much need for a hydrocontin with there being time-release versions of oxycodone and all the C-IIs. Hydrocodone seemed to cause me a lot more nausea when taking it for acute pain and recreationally. Maybe the gov't would consider it less abusable and therefore it would not need to be formulated like the new OxyContin.

  15. #55
    It was labeled as a study for a controlled release pain medication.
    Once I got there they told me what I was going to be taking.
    It was for chronic pain patients currently using opiate painkillers for more then 6 months. I had to show all my medical records and tests. So they knew I was taking Norco 10/325s everyday and sometimes Oxy 10s and 15s.

    For me I find hydrocodone and oxycodone to be very similar. I find oxy more stimulating and a little stronger. If I was in pain and someone told me I couldn't have Oxy, only hydro... I wouldn't be that concerned. If I were to take 40mg of Oxy, I would relate that to taking 60mg of Hydro.

  16. #56
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    If it is true that the government stuck them together in order to "thwart" users from abusing, then that is kind of sick. Personally I'd like to think that there is a beneficial, factual reason for the combination; like another user posted regarding the efficacy of the two together binding more properly on the pain receivers of your brain.

    I would think the government would know better that people with serious addiction problems more often than not do not care about the harm that they are doing to their body and do not even think about the dangerous amounts of acetaminophen they are consuming.

    In keeping with this threads original post, no I have actually never seen hydrocodone without APAP. Oxycodone, yes, but not hydrocodone.
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    I remember about 8 or 10 years ago there was an NROP that offered to mix hydro combinations for you. There's a word for that .... what is it? Anyway, they could make it as pure as you wanted (pure meaning no APAP).

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    Quote Originally Posted by anonsaku View Post
    If it is true that the government stuck them together in order to "thwart" users from abusing, then that is kind of sick. Personally I'd like to think that there is a beneficial, factual reason for the combination; like another user posted regarding the efficacy of the two together binding more properly on the pain receivers of your brain.
    i tend to agree. if the government wanted to use an additive to thwart abuse there would be far better choices than APAP or ibuprofen.

    guyfenisen (sp?) comes to mind. in low doses, it mildly increases the secretion of mucus in your upper respiratory tract in a relatively benign way. in high doses, it acts as an emetic (in other words, it makes you puke). adding the right amount of this would ensure no more than X pills could be consumed in a given time, because if the user tried to consume more than X they would simply puke up the pills. i'm sure there are even much better choices of chemical for this purpose.

    an APAP or ibuprofen overdose can be fatal, however. especially APAP. that is why i believe there must be a medical, pharmaceutical based reason for its presence other than an abuse deterrent.

    IOW, why make a drug more dangerous than it has to be if there is no benefit to doing so?
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  19. #59
    There is Hycodan (Hydrocodone Bitartrate and Homatropine Methylbromide) The Atropine is there for the sole purpose to prevent abuse. Take too much, could go blind.
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  20. #60
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    and guys, if you want hydrocodone without APAP, why go looking for bizarre pills like pure hydrocodone instant release? i have never heard of such a thing, FWIW.

    look, all opiates (including hydrocodone) dissolve easily in water. APAP, not so much, especially when the temperature of the water is low. all i'm gonna say 'bout that.
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